ACC Basketball Update(12/21)

Down goes Duke: Duke lost the battle of the top ten undefeated teams in New York last night 65-64 in OT.  For anyone waiting around to see Duke show some weaknesses they were on display like a store window on 5th Avenue.  Rebounding, lack on intensity, turnovers and poor execution all did the Devils in.  Of course Pitt was not much better on most of those but they found enough to win. Duke was outrebounded by 13 and there was a discernible stretch in the second half where they did not grab an offensive rebound.  Duke also found out what happens when the three don’t fall like they have been.  Obviously toughness questions will be raised since Duke was up 31-14 with five minutes left in the first half and proceeded to be outscored 51-33 the rest of the way.  This was something we saw last season with Duke claiming control of the game before slowing bleeding points until they were flailing in cardiac arrest on the floor.  And one more thing.  The back/butt bump Paulus and Singler did has me questioning their masculinity as though the DUKE on the uniform did not already do that.

Confidence in Miami: It occurred to me that Miami might be following the path Wake Forest football took last season.  Miami came in with zero expectations but simply started winning games.  The more they win, the better they seem to look to the point they are smacking the cupcakes around like a Top 25 team does.  Also, as the win totals go up, the players gain confidence and all of sudden they are playing at a higher level despite the fact on paper they have no business being there.  The jury is still out but right now Miami looks as good as other teams with higher expectations in the ACC.

Clemson loves Puerto Rican Winters: More so than UVa did last season.  The Tigers knocked off PR Mayaguez in their first game at the San Juan Shootout.  Clemson is still playing without James May who hurt his hip three weeks ago.

Odds and Ends: Virginia shook of a pesky Hampton team despite a horrendous game from Sean Singletary who had more turnovers(7) and than assists(4) while dropping a paltry 12 points.  Wake Forest beat back South Florida who really has no business playing in a legitimate basketball conference and Virginia Tech is really not a good team. Only 58 on Liberty?  At least they won.


27 Responses to ACC Basketball Update(12/21)

  1. seth says:

    When ESPN flashed the fast break points well into the second half, Duke only had 2… They are chock full o’ shooters, and good ones at that, but they are still dook slow.

    I’ve said it before, Gerald Henderson being able to dunk without his inhalor (or throwing a punch), does not an athletic team make.

  2. Andy says:

    Also, Singler missed a tip-in as the game ended. Then, Scheyer flailed up an errant put-back with the OT buzzer sounding. Gotta love it.

  3. seth says:

    Yeah, let’s hope that KS continues to play the role of Josh McRoberts. If only we can make him cry, too.

    Scheyer has no legs in the second half of games. I guess he spends too much energy on the faces.

    Paulus may well be the worst point guard in Duke history. Three points. One assist. Zero steals. Five turnovers.

  4. Josh Bowling says:

    I don’t know if it’s the fact that he plays for Duke and my biases kick in, but he seems to have somewhat of an arrogant demeanor about him. When he draws fouls, I mean no-doubt fouls, he goes to the line and does his thing. BUT when he draws fouls that are quite questionable, he walks toward the line nogging his head as if to try to intimidate the opponent. Now it’s a double whammy when you are already intimidated by the foul that you thought you didn’t commit, and the beneficiary goes to the line as if to say “hey, that was a foul, welcome to Duke!”

  5. Josh Bowling says:

    One of my examples from the earlier post is this. I think it was the Virginia game, but I am not sure. Remember when Scheyer was about 25 feet out (3 point range), and he gave a head-fake and drew the defender into the air, when he got his defender off of his feet, he maneauvered his body into the defender and drew the foul, when in a lot of instances, would be a no-call. He, without any humiliity in knowing that was a home court call, was wagging his head as he walked toward the free-throw line. That was one of my examples of his behavior.

  6. Josh Bowling says:

    Look, we have got to give Duke the “guts” cred they deserve for having the audacity to walk onto a neutral court and giving a top ten team all they had! Good job Duke! Despite losing that game, I am convinced they are a top 6-7 team.

  7. Tar Heel Fan says:

    It seemed like the Duke players in general threw their hands up every time they were whistled for a foul.

  8. JMOHN says:


    There is still no doubt this team is much improved from last years squad. I was taken a back by their meltdown throughout the second half. As bad as they played in the second Duke still should have won at the end of regulation and had great chance to win at the end of the OT. With that said I agree with your analysis of the Duke game. But your take on the “The back/butt bump” is a stretch. God forbid those kids have some fun out there. Cant wait to see it when UNC players make a big play and do that. BTW, I see it in the NBA and NFL often. Two players jump up and collide in mid air. Sometimes it chest bump and sometimes they turn to the side which is what that was.


  9. JMOHN says:

    Kyle Singler is better player and a better person than McRoberts. Like the rest of the team he kind of went away in the second. Paulus is hot and cold. No doubt he played a horrible game last night. He is capable of having great games though.

    One more thing. In my world drawing a foul no matter how you do it is a good play. Its called smart basketball. I think you guys call it flopping and pulling jerseys. If it benefits your team thats a good right? Sometimes it can back fire on you too. I have seen it happen a few times with Duke.

    Looks like Clemson is on their way to a 15-0 start followed by an epic meltdown. We will see how they stack up against the ACC.

  10. Josh Bowling says:

    JMOHN, I would never say it doesn’t benefit you to to that. We just have strong and aggressive players, and when you have players like that, they are not conditioned to flopping or falling over when they feel contact, instead we try to absorb it & continue to go up strong assuming we will go to the free throw line, as opposed to flopping down and assuming we will get free throws.

  11. seth says:

    Oh, no doubt Singler is a better player. That’s why I hope he suffers the Krzyzewski Big Man curse and goes the way of McR, Shav, etc.

    Paulus is an excellent scorer (last night excluded), but I have yet to see him be “hot” as a point guard. His numbers were only good his freshman year when he had JJ and Sheldon (the only four year big man K hasn’t ruined in the past fifteen years) to pass to. I’d be even more nervous over our match-up with Duke if Paulus were moved to the two spot but for the most part, as long as he’s got the ball in his hand, I’m not very concered about Duke scoring.

    As for fouls, well…

    Selling a charge is one thing. Getting hit by an invisible man is another.

    And I certainly don’t know the answer to this, but how many referee crews have been suspended, because the ACC trio that called the Duke / Florida State game two years ago were.

  12. 52BigGameJames says:

    let’s give some credit to Pitt–I didn’t see the 1st half, but they played their as*** off in the 2nd. Ref’s are so susceptible to K’s whining everywhere–that late charge call on Pitt was bogus, as we’ve seen so many times in the past. Duke is good enough not to be afforded that advantage! Fields? made one helluva play to seal it–all the Duke players thought it would be a drive and collapsed–he sold it like a barker at a carnival. Neither team has anything to be ashamed of in that one–had the air of a Tournament game. Both teams will go deep this year imo.

  13. Josh Bowling says:

    Of course, this is definately a sweet 16 type of game. When Georgetown meets Memphis, now that will be a final four type of game. Speaking of that, when do they play, tomorrow?

  14. JMOHN says:

    “Krzyzewski Big Man curse and goes the way of McR, Shav, etc.”

    Yeah, If when you say curse you mean blessing. and I don’t know who etc is. As if every big man who played for UNC goes pro ehh.

    Elton Brand – Los Angeles Clippers

    Carlos Boozer – Utah Jazz

    Shelden Williams – Shelden Williams

    Cherokee Parks – Golden St. Warriors (NBA) former

    and the last time I checked Shavlik Randolph is an NBA player as is McRoberts. I would hardly suggest receiving a NBA pay check is getting ruined. Randolph got a shot with the the 76ers b/c of his Duke ties. Curse? I think not.

  15. 52BigGameJames says:

    noon I think Josh

    Randolph & McRob may have nba $, but there can be no denying their Duke careers were train-wrecks-if they succeed in nba it will be in spite of Duke, not because of same.

  16. Tar Heel Fan says:


    Welcome to the blog.

    Some would argue in the case of McBob and Shav that they were actually hurt in terms of stock by being at Duke or in the case of McBob for staying a year too long. Now some of that is a matter of how they were used in a certain system and whether they even made the right decision going to Duke. This is not to slight Duke but many a player has fallen by the wayside for ending up at the wrong school.

    As for the bumping…chest bumping is fine, UNC players do it, I know Duke players do it but the turning and bumping the backs or whatever looked a little too playful. Especially because when Paulus approached Singler he got this big grin on his face. I thought it was worth a little ribbing just to keep it real. 🙂

  17. JMOHN says:

    Their stock shouldn’t have been so high to begin with. I realize we live in a “I Want It Now” era but If your that good it shouldn’t matter what system you play in. If your that good staying shouldn’t hurt your stock it should raise it. Having said that, we have no way of knowing but Shav may have fared better at ncsu then at Duke so I agree with your point there. Also its not like those players wouldn’t have graduated;Under Krzyzewski, 90% of Duke’s scholarship basketball players have graduated, among the highest graduation rates of any NCAA Division I program.
    Those two were really never all that IMO to start with. McBob should have just tried to go pro to begin with and Shav should have went to State. But thats where that NBA age rule comes into play. I have mixed emotions on that as well.

    Thanks for having me. I figured I would try and interrupt the a harmonious blend of Tar Heel Nation here too. Every good blog needs a nemesis. So here I am, Just a fly in the ointment, THF. The monkey in the wrench. The pain in the ass.

    carry on fine sir. 😉

  18. Wilson says:


    That, and I’ve seen them do it A LOT.

    Oh, and here’s McRoberts’ ranking coming out of high school.

    And here’s his NBA numbers (37th player taken in the ’07 draft).

    Portland hasn’t lost a game since he played last, NINE games ago.

    Just sayin’.

  19. seth says:

    Elton Brand — left early.

    Carlos Boozer — left early, screwed his NBA team over.

    Cherokee Parks– are you kidding me?

    The best big men at Duke leave early. The worst transfer out: Eric Boateng, Michael Thompson.

    And then there’s Casey Sanders, Chris Burgess and Greg Newton.

    But on the flip side: There’s Brendan Haywood and Kris Lang…

    wrench away…

  20. Tar Heel Fan says:

    The other thing we learned about McBob was that he was totally a complimentary player. He had no idea what to do being “the guy” last season and since Duke had no #1 sure fired option on offense it hurt them down the stretch in a lot of games. This season they have multiple options

  21. JMOHN says:

    “Cherokee Parks– are you kidding me?”

    -selected by the Dallas Mavericks in the 1st round (12th pick) of the 1995 NBA Draft.

    -Lets not forget about that 1992 national title ring on his finger he won during his freshman year at Duke.

    -Averaged 10 rebounds and 19 points per game during is Senior year at Duke.

    So no, I am not kidding you. This is a problem with some UNC or anti Duke fans. Your lack of respect for even a modest Duke – NBA player illuminates your ignorance.

    Leaving for the NBA early is not reprimand on Duke. That as you should know happens everywhere to everyone. I think K does a fine job in getting some guys he knows will stay all four years and couple he knows will most likely leave early.

    a 3/8″ Angled handle wrench prevents banged knuckles.

  22. Wilson says:

    I wish I new what the recruiting services were thinking when they ranked McBob that high. I guess you can’t fault Duke for that. It’s amazing that he was considered a step above Tyler in high school though.

  23. 52BigGameJames says:

    ok-I’ll say it–and this isn’t just anti-Duke/Coach K: K is one of, if not the best ever at getting his team to play at maximum potential–that he’s a HOF coach there is no doubt. Having said that, one of his undeniable weaknesses, is in his inability to bring a player along who might be struggling. It happens to be one of Roy’s strong points…cases in point:


    we are lucky to have two of the finest coaches in history here at the same time-each has repsective strenghts and weaknesses–I just prefer Roy’s!

  24. Austin says:

    Hey THF

    I liked the back bump and agree calling their masculinity into question was off the mark. Lets let players be playful and not shame them for showing affection for one another. Great analysis otherwise.

    I am not a duke fan of course but wanted them to win that game. I wonder how much the injury on the other team had a role in how Duke finished out that game?

    Enjoying watching our guys dismantle ucsb now.

  25. seth says:

    Quentin Thomas has a ring, too. Does that mean he’s as good as Bobby Hurley?

    I hadn’t realized Cherokee’s dominance his senior year. He must have been Coach Gaudett’s biggest pride.

    And I disrespect our teams equally. I like Haywood only slightly more than Parks.

    Coach K balances attrition? Tell that to William Avery. And I doubt he’s counting on players transferring…

    Honestly, I can’t believe this argument has gone on this long. From a school that’s had Laettner, Brand, Battier and Deng… seriously, we’re going back and forth on Cherokee Parks. I ask again, are you kidding me?

    And if you want to debate NBA paychecks, shouldn’t we also talk about NBA rings?

  26. Josh Bowling says:

    You guys are waaayyyy toooo nice!!!! You can’t be serious, are you? Laettner/Gmisnki/Abdelnaby/Parks/McRoberts versus Billy Cunningham-NBA 50 greatest, Lenny Rosenbluth, Bob McAdoo, Brad Daugherty, Sam Perkins, James Worthy, Rasheed Wallace, Brendan Haywood, Shawn May, Eric Montross. All of which head good to Great NBA careeers. And we are just speaking of big men. Let’s look at guards, shall we?

  27. Josh Bowling says:

    Oh I forgot to mention, James Worth is one of the 50 greatest NBA players as well. There’s just too much to mention when it comes to talking about UNC players that go on to great nba careers, and have coaching. We have not even talked about UNC players that have gone on to make great coaches and general managers.

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